So, I haven't mentioned anything about Iraq in a while. And, I'm still not going to. However, this article speaks about the videos shown of Uday and Qusay. Here is a quote from the article:
Hamza Mansour, secretary-general of the Islamic Action Front in neighboring Jordan, said the display violated Islamic custom.
"The bodies of Uday and Qusay should have been washed, shrouded and buried immediately, but the Americans have no respect for our traditions and doctrine and they acted in a very unethical manner," he said.
I don't get it. Uday and Qusay (and Saddam) have been shown to be sadistic killers. They seem to do things (to the extreme) which are not part of the Muslim doctrine. Yet, people still consider them Muslims, and would expect that they would live and die as a Muslim.
So, what makes you a Muslim? It seems, based on the statement above and the mens lives, that if you are born a Muslim, then you are a Muslim no matter what. This, as opposed to how you live your life.
I would think that when a Muslim is responsible for murdering and torturing and oppress thousands of other Muslims they would sort of lose their "status" of being a Muslim. If you are a Jew and you have a tattoo, you can't be buried in a Jewish cemetary... but I guess if you murder thousands of people, you should still get full Muslim honors.
I just don't get it.
Posted by Kevin at July 26, 2003 09:42 AMWhen I got my first tattoo, my mom freaked out that I wouldn't be able to be buried in a Jewish cemetary. She spoke to her rabbi about that, and he said that is an outdated tradition and they do not prevent people with tattoos from being buried in Jewish cemetaries anymore.
Not that it matters, because I plan to be creamated, but I thought you'd like to know.
Stephanie
Posted by: Stephanie on July 28, 2003 10:27 PMHi Stephanie,
That's interesting. But, I wonder if that varies by location. I'd wager that more orthodox run cemetaries would care. But, that brings up another question.. when does a tradition become outdated? And, who decides it is outdated? (since Judism has no central person like the Pope). Can a Rabbi decide that, ohhhh.. Passover is outdated?
Posted by: Kevin on July 29, 2003 10:19 AMHmmm...I have no idea. I'm not exactly a very good Jew. The last time I set foot inside a temple was for my little sister's Bat Mitzvah when she was 13, and she is 23 now. My parents do go to a Reform temple, but you're probably right that Orthodox temples are more strict. I'll have to ask my parents to ask their rabbi.
Stephanie
Posted by: Stephanie on July 31, 2003 01:33 AMYou know who's part Jewish? Jamie Lynn Sigler. AKA Meadow Soprano. She's freakin' beautiful.
Posted by: MySlowAcura on August 6, 2003 01:28 PMYeah, she's pretty damn hot.
Posted by: Kevin on August 6, 2003 01:33 PMin terms of muslim burial rituals. regardless of how bad a person you were, you still deserve a decent burial when you die. that whole family was horrible, and i feel the world is better off without them in any position of power (or life in some cases), but a decent burial, according to local traditions/customs is still necessary. if we were to think of how we personally, emotionally, felt about their lives and then buried them improperly, that'd be very low and childish. certain respect needs to be shown for the dead, regardless of how their lives were lived.
Posted by: omar on September 6, 2003 12:26 PMHi Omar,
But, it seems that they were only Muslim by label, not by practice. Isn't it against Muslim laws to murder other Muslims? Isn't that one of the things done by these men? Just because you are born into a Muslim family (or any religion) doesn't mean you are a person of that religion. If you don't follow the laws of that religion, and walk in the footsteps of your prophet, then you have nothing more than a label. Many have said that Saddam is a fake Muslim... just doing things for show. His actions, and his sons actions, seem to go directly against precepts of the Muslim religion. Honoring them as a Muslim seems to degrade the religion. You are Muslim (or any religion) based on your actions, not on your label.
Were the mass graves Shiites and others were thrown into respectful? No.
Posted by: Kevin on September 6, 2003 12:42 PMthough the muslim people have changed drastically over the last few hundred years, they seem more and more like anyother group of humans all the time. in my personal view, which is not to be defended, people are people. they are not much different from other groups of the same organism.
justice, peace, war, hate, love, all emotions and ideas based on the sense interpretations. so one must ask when trying to dissect the "why" of anything, is anything really pure? are all these things tainted by over all rational and sense?
what may seem evident is that upholding muslim traditions in death are they way of their people. true.
but what is the way of most people, is to be utterly disgusted by what some individuals do! especially by accounts of what happened to the shiite, who has any ounce of care for those long-upheld muslim traditions??
all the "problems" in the middle east are as representational of the human's defective nature as any other. most are based on misunderstanding, confusion, hate, greed, etc. fundamentally, to hope for a sudden change in heart for any people of the world, is as about as hopeful as saying americans will give up their yards so that starving homeless from around the world can live in them!
i, personally, am more moved by the amount of damage one does in life, than to say that i give a crap about their condition of passing in death.
sorry if i offend anyone, but voices always collide.
spon.
Posted by: spon on January 27, 2004 02:40 PMI have a question about the Jewish tradition of not burying any jewish person with a tattoo. What was done about with the remains of the jews that died in concentration camps? They were tattooed a numbers on there bodies, given it was unwanted? Just curious...Mahalo IZ
Posted by: Iz on June 10, 2004 02:26 PMI once asked about this, and I was told it was because the tattoos were forced, not desired.
Posted by: Kevin on June 10, 2004 02:32 PMThanks for signing in, . Now you can comment. (sign out)
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